Episode 23: How a Layoff Propelled Ashley Cao to her Real Estate Journey
Ashley shares her incredible journey from a career in tech to becoming a real estate investor and commercial lender. We dive into her experiences with real estate investing, her passion for DJing, and how she navigated her career transitions.
Takeaway 1: Navigating Career Transitions
Ashley shares her journey from working at Tesla and Waymo to pivoting into real estate investing and commercial lending. She emphasizes the importance of being open to new opportunities and leveraging transferable skills.
Takeaway 2: Building a Real Estate Portfolio
Ashley discusses how she built her real estate portfolio while working full-time in tech.💡 She shares valuable tips on leveraging stock options and savings to invest in properties.
Takeaway 3: The Power of Networking and Mentorship
Ashley underscores the significance of networking and finding mentors in your field. She talks about how attending conferences and engaging with communities like BiggerPockets helped her grow as an investor. Thank you for tuning into this insightful episode of The BreakThrough! We hope Ashley's journey and tips inspire you to take bold steps in your career and investments.
TRANSCRIPT
∎ Teaser / Highlighted Clip
[Ashley Cao] (0:00 - 0:34)
BiggerPockets was like the main thing that I used, right? As far as forums and networking with folks, but my circle of friends were not investors. And so I couldn't be like, hey, like tell me more about this.
It was more like, okay, well, I guess we'll just figure it. And then I was like, this is my first time. And I think I had like that fear of like failure and like exposing my failure.
And so I was like, I'm just gonna do it on my own. And if it does well, then I'll tell somebody about it. But if it doesn't do well, I'm gonna shut the hell up and not say anything.
∎ Podcast Intro:
[Stephen Husted] (0:35 - 2:32)
Welcome to The Breakthrough with Steven Husted, the show that takes you behind the scenes with successful entrepreneurs, real estate investors, and other movers and shakers in the business world. In each episode, we'll sit down with our guests to explore their personal and professional journeys, including the challenges they faced, the breakthrough moments that propelled them to success, and the strategies and the tactics they used to get there. Get inspired by new ideas and strategies and get to know our guests on a deeper level.
Join us for candid conversations, powerful insights, and plenty of breakthrough moments. Please help us grow by subscribing and sharing the podcast and welcome to the show.
∎ Guest Introduction:
Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of The Breakthrough with Steven Husted.
Today, we have an incredible guest who's a tech guru turned real estate maven, Ashley Kao. Ashley has a fascinating journey from working with giants like Tesla and Waymo to becoming a powerhouse in the real estate investment world. In this episode, we dive into her transition from tech to real estate, her experiences managing properties remotely, and some of the craziest contractor stories you'll ever hear.
Plus, we explore her passion for DJing and how it complements her business ventures. You don't wanna miss Ashley's insights on leveraging stock options for real estate investments and the pivotal moments that shaped her career. We also get into some real talk about the challenges and rewards of pivoting careers.
Tune in for a mix of tech, real estate, and some serious, cool DJ stories. Trust me, this is one episode you don't wanna skip.
∎ Podcast Proper:
All right, we're live.
Awesome.
[Ashley Cao] (2:33 - 2:37)
Yeah, thanks for joining. Yeah, yeah, thank you for having me, I appreciate it.
[Stephen Husted] (2:38 - 2:59)
We were talking about, you know, last time we spoke and I was kind of blown away that it's been a couple years. It seems like it was only, you know, a year ago. Yeah, but we were at the Bigger Pockets Conference.
I think that's where, I think I met you walking. I mean, we were walking from the convention to go get food with like a group of people. Is that what I remember?
Okay
[Ashley Cao] (3:00 - 3:01)
That's correct, yeah, there was like a big group of us.
[Stephen Husted] (3:02 - 3:07)
I don't even remember how we got together like that, but it was like we were just all walking together, like, hey, where are we going? We're gonna get food.
[Ashley Cao] (3:08 - 3:21)
Yeah, sounds great, sounds awesome. And I remember you telling me that you were working on putting together like a content studio. So it looks like it's happening, so it's awesome.
[Stephen Husted] (3:22 - 5:03)
Yeah, I put it together, you know, it's so funny. It's in the Rose Garden area, so I'm right off Park. Okay, yeah.
Park in Meridian. And, you know, it's a really old building, but you know, it doesn't really matter. It's a small little room.
And initially I was thinking, I'm gonna bring the guests in here, but then I was like booking a lot of guests that were out of state or, you know, down in LA. So then I just put it on hold, like, okay, I'm just gonna keep doing them like this on Riverside for the time being. But I think at some point, the only problem with this building and this room that I've learned is soundproofing.
Because it's basically two rooms, like a size of a bedroom. So we have two of them. We go through one door and then there's another door.
But the room that I'm in, there's a door that goes out to the hallway. And then sometimes if people hear her moving in or they're showing some of the other units, you can hear it. Like I need to really soundproof.
And I've been pretty good at, you know, dodging the bullet, so to speak, knock on wood. Yeah. Not having too many crazy things, but the windows are single pane.
So sometimes I can hear somebody mowing their lawn. I'm like, okay, whatever. But, you know, and it's funny.
The one thing I've learned about this particular room, media room, is the next one I would do is making it like much more dual purpose. Meaning be able to like change up the looks as much as possible so that you can shoot different content and not get, I don't know, I just get bored. Like, okay, I'm tired of what this looks like.
[Ashley Cao] (5:04 - 5:05)
I want to change this out, you know?
[Stephen Husted] (5:05 - 5:18)
But that's just the creative side of me. Just, you know, always wanting to make it look different and cool. So what's on the, you got Stevie Wonder.
[Ashley Cao] (5:19 - 5:22)
Oh, yeah, you're good. I didn't know you could recognize that from here.
[Stephen Husted] (5:22 - 5:39)
Well, you know what's funny right now on Riverside? Sometimes the video quality, it's coming out good when it records and downloads, but like what I see of you, it's a little bit kind of fuzzy. Okay.
But I do know the top right is Stevie Wonder.
[Ashley Cao] (5:40 - 6:19)
Yes. We got Stevie Wonder. Let me see.
We got a lot of, actually a few little artists on here. So Stevie Wonder is the only guy. Oh, I guess the middle right here, you can't tell what it is, but it's the Carpenters.
So the ultra throwback. That's my mom's favorite group, I guess. And so there's Aaliyah, TLC, Purr, and SZA.
So I try to change those out once in a while. You know, same thing with you, change the background a little bit. So, but it's funny, cause like people do notice Stevie Wonder the most cause he's probably the most recognizable on there, so.
[Stephen Husted] (6:20 - 6:20)
It's the cover.
[Ashley Cao] (6:21 - 6:21)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (6:21 - 6:42)
It's that cover, it's like an iconic cover. Interesting enough, the Carpenters, you're gonna like this story cause this is up your alleyway. Yeah.
So back in the nineties, I got booked to DJ in Cabo for MTV.
[Ashley Cao] (6:43 - 6:43)
Okay.
[Stephen Husted] (6:43 - 7:46)
And so me and my buddy flew out there and they put us up in this really cool villa. And I was sleeping in this circular room that was like domed. And I started sleeping in there and had these like wild dreams of this lady.
Okay. And she was really thin and, you know, just kind of like disheveled. And I like kind of like had Otterbot experiences kind of flew out the window.
I guess I started screaming in the middle of the night. Okay. Woke up the people that were staying there.
And then there's a couple of people that were, that like managed the property as well that were staying on location. And I told them like, yeah, it was just like really thin woman, long hair. And they like look at each other and they're like, yeah, this was Karen Carpenter's old house.
Whoa. The room you're sleeping in is the room that they would record music from time to time.
[Ashley Cao] (7:48 - 7:52)
I just got chills. That's crazy. Crazy.
Crazy.
[Stephen Husted] (7:53 - 8:45)
And then the following day we go to the beach. I think it was the office. I can't remember, but I'm pretty sure it was somewhere by the office if you've ever been to Cabo.
And they interviewed me on this radio station. And so I go on this radio station and I said something to reference that I liked Latinos. Okay.
And I'm like, yeah, I like Latino women. And I think they're really beautiful. And the guy like looks and he's like, I think you could have a lot of people at the show.
And so we pulled up to go to the show that night. And it was just girls going down the street and they're like packed trying to get into this club. It was the most insane, like crazy.
That's one of my funny DJ stories back in the nineties. But I know that you DJ.
[Ashley Cao] (8:46 - 9:04)
Yes, I do. For fun, for fun. Great.
It's a nice creative outlet for me. Outlet or just all the business and real estate stuff. So it's a nice release site.
I try to pick up gigs here and there. I actually didn't know you DJ, so we should play sometime.
[Stephen Husted] (9:04 - 9:18)
Yeah. You know, I haven't DJ, honestly, I haven't DJ'd since 2005 in San Jose. I mean, well, so yeah, I got a pretty checkered past back in the rave days and DJing.
You know what I'm saying?
[Ashley Cao] (9:19 - 9:19)
Yeah, yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (9:19 - 9:42)
I can leave it at that. You know what? You know what was going down.
I grew up in the nineties. I went to raves. And so I had to get my act together in 2005.
So I haven't pulled out my decks since then, but it is calling me back into, you know, setting up my equipment again and buying all new equipment because everything has changed now.
[Ashley Cao] (9:42 - 9:42)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (9:42 - 9:45)
Everything's digital. Are you all digital? Are you still using vinyl?
[Ashley Cao] (9:46 - 10:03)
I have vinyl. I have the turntables, like the old school turntables and all that stuff. And then I also do have like a controller.
So more digital stuff. So the digital stuff is more portable. These turntables are super heavy and clunky and all that stuff.
[Stephen Husted] (10:03 - 10:05)
Are they 1200s?
[Ashley Cao] (10:05 - 10:06)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (10:06 - 10:08)
Yeah, the go-to.
[Ashley Cao] (10:08 - 10:11)
You gotta have them. They're like- You gotta have them. It's a part of history, you know?
[Stephen Husted] (10:12 - 10:29)
It is. The next DJ booth I build, they will have all, you know, probably all the CDJs and they'll probably have all the, you know, the techie stuff that's going on. But I have three turntables and a URI mixer in my storage.
[Ashley Cao] (10:29 - 10:29)
Nice.
[Stephen Husted] (10:30 - 10:34)
And enough records to basically like fill a whole room.
[Ashley Cao] (10:35 - 10:35)
That's amazing.
[Stephen Husted] (10:36 - 10:58)
I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna, I'm gonna have all the turntables still and I'll just have to build the whole room out in our next house. I think that's what the direction is going. It's already going that way.
I'm just, it's slowly, you know, moving towards that. Cause it's such a, it's such, like you said, it's such a great outlet. It's just a good, positive thing to do.
[Ashley Cao] (10:58 - 10:59)
Yeah, definitely.
[Stephen Husted] (11:00 - 11:03)
How did you get into it? I'm curious about that.
[Ashley Cao] (11:04 - 12:49)
Speaking of like rave days, I went to like a show. Well, I went to like, I went to a lot of like shows and stuff. And then the show that really just like captivated me and I was so impressed by how, how well the DJ just like made the audience feel and all that stuff was, this is like back in like, probably like 2011, 2012 when Zedd was coming out on, you know, he's becoming a little bit more popular.
And I went to a show and it just blew my mind. I was like, this little guy up on stage is like making the crowd feel some type of way. And I left that show just like feeling energized and it just felt like an amazing experience.
And so I was like, who does, like, we're just DJing, right? And so that kind of made me think about it a little bit more. And then I had a friend who was a DJ.
And so like we would do sessions. He'd come over and bring his stuff and you know, he'd teach me some things. And so I started just kind of like dabbling in it and I bought like a super basic controller, but it kind of fell off because I just started doing, I got into like real estate and stuff.
And so that like took a lot of my time. And then I started getting back into it probably like 2019 and then right when the pandemic hit, I was like, oh, I'm jumping in like super deep. And then that's when I got like all this equipment.
So I got like turntables, I got a mixer, just because I had another friend who's a DJ and she was like, you should learn on turntables because if you learn on turntables, you can pretty much learn on any system because this is the old school way, right?
[Stephen Husted] (12:49 - 12:50)
Yeah.
[Ashley Cao] (12:51 - 13:46)
And so YouTube University, you know, all of the pandemic was me watching tons of YouTubes. A lot of people were on Twitch doing shows and stuff like that. And so it was just so super inspiring.
And so I just, yeah, I just dove deep into it. And then once things started opening back up, you know, I got involved with an all women's DJ group. So it's like a collective of women, you know, providing a safe space for women to just grow in the primarily male dominated industry and started just playing with them and picking up gigs through them and stuff.
So it's been a super fun just outlet and an opportunity to experiment with new music and then also experience new venues, new people and all that stuff. So it's been fun.
[Stephen Husted] (13:47 - 14:21)
Yeah, I think it's a, that's so great. Cool, I got like goosebumps when you're talking about that. I just love hearing, I love hearing people talk about that because I think it's a, I loved hearing people's stories on how they got into DJing and something, how they got inspired to actually take the leap and, you know, go the distance to, you know, collect music and learn how to cue records and how to set a vibe.
I mean, that's, the thing about DJing is you could give five DJs, five records and they're all gonna set a different vibe.
[Ashley Cao] (14:21 - 14:21)
Oh, for sure.
[Stephen Husted] (14:21 - 14:52)
And that's the beauty of being a DJ and being creative is just because somebody has the same records, they're gonna set a whole different vibe. They're gonna interpret it differently. You know, that's, what's been so cool about, I still, I'm glued to DJs on a daily basis.
You know, like I work out, I do all these big endurance events on my bike, you know, like eight hour races and I'll listen to like John Digweed and Sasha for eight hours straight.
[Ashley Cao] (14:52 - 14:53)
You know what I mean?
[Stephen Husted] (14:53 - 15:03)
Just, it was like, what do you listen to? And I'm like, John Digweed and Sasha. Like, really, why?
I'm like, well, because they're a continuous mix, the beat is perfect for running or cycling.
[Ashley Cao] (15:03 - 15:08)
You know, it's just like. Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (15:08 - 15:24)
Yeah, that's awesome. So I know she got a pretty extensive background in tech. I knew about Waymo.
I think you had told me about Waymo when we were walking that day. For some reason I knew about that, but I didn't know you were at Tesla too.
[Ashley Cao] (15:25 - 20:57)
Yes. So it's funny. I probably changed careers, I guess four times now, right?
And so I started off, when I went to college, I was like, okay, what am I gonna do? And so I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do. And I guess I'll take it back to like my childhood.
When I was young, my first language was Vietnamese. So I didn't speak English first. And so I learned Vietnamese as a child.
And then I went to American school. And at that time there wasn't English as a second language classes to teach you how to speak English and all that stuff. You're going to American school because that's what you do here.
And then so she threw me into school and I had, it was like me being put on Mars and meeting aliens, right? Because I did not speak English and I had no idea what people were saying. And so I was super shy.
Like my first year in American school, I didn't speak at all. I was just a wallflower trying to absorb kind of what was going on and try to understand this language. And yeah.
And so growing up as a kid, I was super shy and shy to the point where like, I would miss out on opportunities where I wouldn't speak up in certain situations. And so that really like bothered me because I hated that I was so shy. I was like, how do I get over this like shyness?
Because in my head, I'm like, I want to talk. But like externally, I'm like, I'm scared. I'm not going to say anything.
And so as I kind of started growing up, I obviously, you know, I eventually started talking and I learned English. And the really cool thing is, you know, throughout even my first year in American school, I did, I had friends. So I had friends who like befriended me and like included me in play, even though I had not spoken a word to them.
And so it was really, it was like an amazing experience because I was like, holy shit, like these people are still accepting of me even though I was different from them. So anyway, so yeah, I kind of, you know, grew up super shy and I was like, okay, how do I like overcome this shyness? And so I think at a younger age, I was, I saw that like marketing and sales was like people who were not me or like they're super talkative.
They can go and like talk to anyone and build a relationship with anyone and do all that. So I was like, I wanna learn how to do, how they do that. And so when I was, you know, in school, that's kind of what I was thinking about.
Okay, maybe I wanna do marketing cause that's like, that will help train me how to get outside of my comfort zone eventually. And so I went to college studying marketing and then after I graduated, I picked up a couple of marketing gigs, right? So I worked for a toy company.
I worked for an app development company. And I think that's kind of was my first plug into like technology. It was working for the app company because that's when iPhones just started coming out in some form, aging my group a little bit.
And so like iPhones started coming out and then these apps came out on these phones. And so I was like, well, this is super cool. Like, you know, before we had our razors and our flip phones, that didn't do much.
Razor. And so like, so now, you know, this like touchscreen and you can do all this crazy stuff with your phone. And so that's, you know, I was like, okay, I'm fascinated by technology.
You know, of course I live in the Bay area. And so that's Silicon Valley technology is like the epicenter over here. And so I was very interested in that, but I realized that doing marketing for an app development company was not what I wanted to do because I'm pretty much convincing you to buy like a $5 app that you don't use after a month.
And so I just felt it was like not very fulfilling for me on a personal level. And so I started looking for other jobs and I was in an interview for another marketing job and the recruiter that I was talking with was like, hey, have you ever thought about becoming a recruiter? And I was like, what is that?
You know, I have no idea what that was. And they're like, well, it's kind of like marketing, but you're marketing people and you're marketing jobs. And so you're helping people find jobs.
And I'm like, oh, that sounds way better than convincing you to buy a $5 app. You know, no offense to those people who do that, but like, it was just, it wasn't for me. And so I started exploring recruiting and then I eventually got into tech recruiting, so technical recruiting.
And so that was, you know, me hiring or sourcing and finding engineers to come work at these great companies. And so I worked for an agency first and I was recruiting for Apple. And so like- Oh, cool.
Yeah, so- Really cool. Yeah, so I started, that was like my first like tech like company and I would go on site at Apple and like meet with my candidates and all that stuff. And I was like, this is so freaking cool.
Like I'm working essentially, I guess for Apple. And so I was there for a couple of years and then eventually Tesla reached out to me. And so they said, hey, we're looking for recruiters.
Are you interested?
[Stephen Husted] (20:57 - 20:58)
What year was that?
[Ashley Cao] (20:59 - 21:55)
This was, oh man, 2015, 2016, I think it was. So this is before model three. And so, and I knew Tesla was still kind of in its like startup phase, right?
So people were kind of like, what is this company? And then living in the Bay Area- We saw it kind of unfolding. Yeah, I remember like my neck broke the first time I saw a Model S because I was like, what car is that?
It looks so dope. And so that was like my first like, okay, that's a Tesla. And then, you know, fast forward a year or whatever to later Tesla calls and they say, hey, we're looking for recruiters.
And I was like, I need to go to this company because this is like super cool technology. It's new, right? Electric cars were not that popular or if they were popular, they weren't sexy like Tesla.
[Stephen Husted] (21:56 - 21:57)
Yeah, that's totally true.
[Ashley Cao] (21:57 - 22:39)
And then once I kind of started understanding what the company does and like their kind of whole vertical integration, right? So they have their chargers, they have their power wall for their home, they have solar, all that stuff. I was like, this is amazing.
Like, why didn't somebody think about this earlier? And so I was at Tesla for about four years recruiting engineers who did the speakers for the car or like the infotainment system or the body of the vehicle. So different types of, you know, mechanical and electrical engineers.
And I had a lot of fun there, but the work was a lot, you know?
[Stephen Husted] (22:39 - 22:40)
It was insane.
[Ashley Cao] (22:40 - 22:44)
It was nuts. I know it's insane. And I'm sure people hear all the time.
[Stephen Husted] (22:44 - 22:46)
You don't need to sugarcoat it.
[Ashley Cao] (22:46 - 23:10)
Yeah, it was nuts. And so lots of pressure, you know, you're working definitely over 40, 50 hours a week. And, but you know, at the time I was young and I was like excited about the company.
And like, there is something about that Tesla effect where it's like, you drink the Kool-Aid and you're like, I'm so down for this company because it's doing such a big mission.
[Stephen Husted] (23:11 - 23:23)
And- I was just gonna say that. I was just gonna say everybody's on a mission and for a company with that many verticals and things going on, yeah, they really do have to have everybody on a mission.
[Ashley Cao] (23:23 - 23:23)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (23:23 - 23:24)
So to speak, right?
[Ashley Cao] (23:24 - 23:25)
It was, it was mission.
[Stephen Husted] (23:25 - 23:33)
How was the interview process? Was that insane or was it pretty tame or how did that all go? And like, how many interviews did you end up having?
[Ashley Cao] (23:34 - 24:24)
I think I went through, I think I met four or five people. And so it was- Four or five rounds? Four or five rounds.
And so after, you know, a couple of phone interviews and stuff like that. And so it was pretty extensive, I would say. And it was me meeting not only other recruiters, but also engineers.
So the potential engineering managers that I would be working with. So it was really, I mean, it was challenging, but it was also very cool because I had never been in a Tesla since then. And so my manager at the time was like, oh, we're going for a ride then.
So he like books a Model S and takes me on a test drive and shows me the ludicrous mode at the time, I think it was. And so like zero to 60 in like what? Two point something seconds or whatever it was.
And it blew my mind. It was like, this is an amazing- Where were you?
[Stephen Husted] (24:24 - 24:27)
Were you up in Fremont or were you in Palo Alto?
[Ashley Cao] (24:27 - 24:28)
Palo Alto, yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (24:28 - 24:29)
Okay, cool.
[Ashley Cao] (24:30 - 24:43)
Yeah, so I like lost my shit when he like hit that ludicrous mode or insane mode. And I was like, I need to work for this company. And so that's what sold me.
It was just seeing the car in action and stuff, so.
[Stephen Husted] (24:44 - 24:48)
And then, so you were there for how long? When was the last year you worked there?
[Ashley Cao] (24:49 - 26:17)
So I was there for four years. Man, I don't remember my dates anymore. So I was there for four years.
And then, so I left in 20, the end of, like 2020, beginning of 2020. So yeah, the beginning of 2020, I came over to Waymo. And the reason I went over to Waymo was a couple of things.
I really liked the technology that Waymo was doing too. And I think it was different, right? So Tesla is like an electric vehicle that has some self-driving features, which is really great, great technology.
But Waymo was primarily focused on the self-driving technology. So not necessarily electric cars or anything like that. And so I wanted to learn more about that because I was in autopilot or supporting autopilot for some time when I was at Tesla.
And I was fascinated by that. And so I was like, I want to learn more about that stuff. And then Waymo being part of Google or a subsidiary of Alphabet family, I knew that there was like work-life balance kind of thing.
And so going from Tesla, working long, long hours, I wanted to kind of experience a different culture. So that was like a 180 for me of like how much different the culture was and how much resources there were because Tesla was still in the startup. Model 3 just launched right when I left.
I think it was. And so, yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (26:18 - 26:22)
Let's grind it out, people. We're figuring this out as we go. Let's make things and break things.
[Ashley Cao] (26:22 - 26:23)
Yep, yep.
[Stephen Husted] (26:25 - 26:28)
And we don't got time for anything else. Let's do this.
[Ashley Cao] (26:28 - 26:33)
Meanwhile, Waymo was like, hey, you get a free massage. Thanks for joining me.
[Stephen Husted] (26:33 - 26:39)
Yes, you need your dry cleaning done? How many meals do you need? Are you gloom free?
We got that for you too.
[Ashley Cao] (26:40 - 26:43)
They're like, oh, free food? I never heard of that before.
[Stephen Husted] (26:45 - 26:58)
Well, they want to take care of you. They want you to work too. And yeah, they've already figured out the work life.
But I'd imagine you've hopefully kept some of your Tesla stock. I would imagine you got a chunk of that Yes, that's good.
[Ashley Cao] (26:59 - 27:01)
So I kept majority of it, I would say.
[Stephen Husted] (27:02 - 27:03)
Good for you.
[Ashley Cao] (27:04 - 27:45)
And the thing was, so like I mentioned real estate earlier. So through all of this, I was investing in real estate on the side, right? And so I was working my W2 job, but then I knew that I wanted to, I learned about passive income.
And I was like, oh, that sounds like a good thing to do in the meantime. And so having stock and well-paying salary I knew that I wanted to invest it into to something that will bring me returns. And luckily enough, I had talked to a friend early on where I was telling him, I was like, oh yeah, I have all this stock, but I don't want to sell it because I have to pay for the capital gains.
[Stephen Husted] (27:46 - 27:47)
Oh, I know what you're gonna say.
[Ashley Cao] (27:47 - 28:44)
And so that unlocked something for me because I was like, holy crap, like why don't a lot of people know about this? And so he suggested that I get a securities-backed line of credit. And I was like, I have no idea what that is.
And then I had a HELOC before, right? And so I used the HELOC to buy real estate, but the securities-backed line of credit, I'd never heard of. And so I looked into that and it's the same thing, right?
It's like your collateral is your securities, your stock. And so, and the approval, like there's no credit check. It doesn't show up on your credit report.
And so I was like, this is amazing. And so I leveraged that to buy properties and that's kind of how I got started in real estate while I was in my tech job, so yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (28:45 - 28:55)
That's so funny. That's kind of my story as well. I, you know, I did an equity line and then like levered my stocks too.
[Ashley Cao] (28:55 - 29:06)
Yeah, that's amazing. I'm like, why are the people, like you hear about HELOC all the time, right? But I feel like S-blocks or, you know, things like that are not really talked about that often.
[Stephen Husted] (29:06 - 29:12)
I'm glad that you- One of my real estate clients is the one that turned me on. And he's like, look, I don't sell my stock. I borrow against it.
[Ashley Cao] (29:12 - 29:12)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (29:13 - 30:18)
And you know, it's like over time, certain people put something in your ear and it like can change your life in a lot of ways, you know what I mean? Or put you in a new direction. It's interesting.
And when he said that to me and he's like, I don't want to pay taxes. So I borrow against it. I was like, well, I got stock.
I want to go buy real estate. So I did the same thing. That's amazing.
I was like, now this is great. That's so funny. How did you juggle?
Cause I get this question asked a lot cause I work with a lot of people that work in tech that want to be investors and they either have, you know, vested stock. They want to put into real estate, but you know, they don't really understand the back, the ins and outs of the day-to-day because there's a lot to it. I think more than most people understand until they're really actively in it.
And they start going, oh gosh, this is a lot of work. If you don't have systems and teams and people to help you. How did you manage that in the very beginning?
How did you put together those first steps and start working? Did you have partners? How did you do all that?
[Ashley Cao] (30:19 - 31:31)
So I actually started doing it solo because at the time, I mean, bigger pockets was like the main thing that I used, right? As far as forums and networking with folks. But I had like my circle of friends were not investors.
And so I couldn't be like, hey, like, tell me more about this. You know, it was more like, okay, well, I guess we'll just figure it out. And then I was like, this is my first time.
And I think I had like that fear of like failure and like exposing my failure. And so I was like, I'm just gonna do it on my own. And if it does well, then I'll tell somebody about it.
But if it doesn't do well, I'm gonna shut the hell up. And so that was like my first like, okay, that, you know. And so I started there, but then I started to realize that it is like real estate investing.
And a lot of businesses are a relationship type of sport. Right? Absolutely.
And so me doing it alone was very lonely and like not fun because I was like, oh God, like I'm in my own head and trying to figure it out.
[Stephen Husted] (31:31 - 31:39)
And so- You can't bounce anything off anybody and you just kind of, yeah. You know, your brain is either working for or against you.
[Ashley Cao] (31:39 - 32:16)
Yeah. Yeah. And so I leaned on the BiggerPockets forum because then at least for me, maybe, you know, I was still, I'm still shy here and there.
Right? And so like for me, the forums was an easy way for me to, I guess, expose myself and then feel more comfortable, you know, after being more involved in the forum and stuff. So I would ask questions and if I knew something, then I would answer those questions.
And so that was like my like segue into just like networking and learning how to connect with other people who were doing the same thing as me.
[Stephen Husted] (32:18 - 32:25)
And then- Were you reaching out to people at that point too? Like were you DMing people and getting on the phone? Yeah.
[Ashley Cao] (32:25 - 32:25)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (32:25 - 32:30)
So that was- And were they more local or did you have, were you talking to people all throughout the United States?
[Ashley Cao] (32:30 - 33:08)
All throughout the United States. And I mean, I still am in touch with a good amount of them to this day. And like my first, like my first BiggerPockets friend, I think is, he lives in Washington.
And so- Oh really? Yeah. And so I think I saw him on the forums.
He's like, I'm new, just trying to learn. And I was like, that's me. Right?
And so I was like, I was like, I'm going to hit him up because we're on the same level. Right? And so, so yeah.
So yeah, it was just, it was, if it weren't for BiggerPockets, I don't think it would have been as easy for me to continue to move on. And so, yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (33:08 - 35:37)
Yeah, that's a, that's a big, I think BiggerPockets, I think BiggerPockets and just social media, having YouTube and all these different places to go to either jump into a community and learn, even if it's just you're quiet in the background, you can definitely plug yourself in, even if you're shy or new and sit back and start to go down that rabbit hole. And you couldn't do that. It was different.
Like I wanted to get into real estate back in like 2004. And I read Rich Dad, Poor Dad, you know, on a trip, you know, I was in Maui and read the book and I'm like, yeah, I want to get into real estate. And it was weird.
I went to like a conference in San Francisco. I don't even remember who it was, but I just remember it was somebody on stage talking about how to flip a house, you know, it was all this rah, rah. And then everybody just walks out out into the hall and he has like a CD.
And you buy this, you know what I mean? Like you buy the CD and that's it. You walk away and it's, there's no community.
You know, nobody you can kind of lean into. And just the infrastructure was different then. People, all the information was kept to oneself and it wasn't spread through, it wasn't given out freely, let's just say that.
It was just a different time period. So, yeah, I totally understand what you're saying because when I got into it, I'd broke my wrist snowboarding and I just was sitting at home and, you know, went down the rabbit hole, got onto YouTube and I was like, people are investing out of state and like going through all the scenarios. I'm like, why am I trying to save all this money to, you know, buy an investment property in California where I need, you know, half a million dollars and all the, you know, the friction to it all.
And I'm like, I want to get, and so I was like, all right, let's go out of state, you know, so I went to a BiggerPockets conference, bought properties at the conference, like literally, you know, did all this crazy. It was like, I'm going to buy in Detroit and I'm going to fly to Kansas City and yeah, we'll see how this works. Yeah.
It's just funny, right? You know, and I think BiggerPockets allows people to really, you know, take, carve their own path at their own timeline. I think it's just been a great, great thing all around.
How many conferences have you been to?
[Ashley Cao] (35:39 - 35:46)
Ooh, I try to go to at least, I would say I try to go to at least two or three out of the year.
[Stephen Husted] (35:46 - 35:47)
Okay.
[Ashley Cao] (35:47 - 36:06)
It's probably more before, but now I just, I try to do more meetups, like local stuff. And so I try to get out there and meet other people in the area. Because there's a lot of people who are doing the same thing as me.
They're investing in real estate or in apartments and all this stuff. Yeah, so it's easier.
[Stephen Husted] (36:06 - 36:11)
Did you start your own meetup? Or did you work with somebody else to do it? Were you doing a meetup?
[Ashley Cao] (36:11 - 36:12)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (36:12 - 36:13)
Either you or somebody else?
[Ashley Cao] (36:14 - 36:55)
So my business partner and I, we have a monthly meetup in Lopez. So it's the second Wednesday of every month. And it's just super casual.
It's like from five to seven, you come in, grab a beer, talk shop, right? And so, and that's literally what I did through BiggerPockets, but now you can do it in person. And so I wanted to kind of like be able to provide that for other people because that's what helped get me started.
And so we do that. And then we do like a quarterly one where we do a little bit more formatted and we have like an agenda and we have guest speakers and stuff. So it's all real estate related.
[Stephen Husted] (36:56 - 36:59)
When did you, what year was it when you bought your first investment property?
[Ashley Cao] (37:02 - 37:04)
2018 was my first investment property.
[Stephen Husted] (37:04 - 37:05)
And what was it?
[Ashley Cao] (37:06 - 38:05)
It was a duplex in Columbus, Ohio. It was, so at the time that was when Brandon Turner was all about Burr and talking about Burr. And so I was like, I want to do that.
Well, I want to recycle my money. And so I was like, I'm going to find a Burr. And so I made it a point to try to make an offer once a week.
So I was like, okay, I'm going to analyze as many properties as I can and then make an offer once a week. And I did that for like, I don't know, four months or something like that and nothing hit. And so I was like, shit, okay, I'm just going to keep going because it's consistency, right?
And so, and then I got feedback from one seller and they said, I accepted another offer, but I have a portfolio of 10 properties that I'm looking to offload that are exactly the same as what you were looking at. And so he's like, I'm going to send you the list. Let me know if one that you're interested in.
And I was like, crazy. I was like, okay, this is awesome.
[Stephen Husted] (38:06 - 38:15)
And so- This just fell in my lap. I went from not being able to do anything to here's a portfolio. Let me see if I can, let me underwrite this scenario.
[Ashley Cao] (38:15 - 38:27)
Right. And so this is like my first property. So I ended up in hindsight, always in hindsight, it's like, I should have bought all 10 because it was all in the same neighborhood.
[Stephen Husted] (38:28 - 38:28)
Oh, wow.
[Ashley Cao] (38:28 - 38:30)
In the same block pretty much.
[Stephen Husted] (38:31 - 38:31)
Oh, that's crazy.
[Ashley Cao] (38:34 - 39:37)
And so I bought one, right? One out of this fricking 10. Yeah.
And I burned it. I probably left like 12,000 in the deal. So it was like almost a perfect burn.
But after I'd done that and I'm like, oh my God, it works. I was like, I should have done that for all 10. And then I would have been like smooth sailing now.
And so like, but yeah, so that was my first deal. It was a burn, it was a duplex. It took a while for the rehab because, so I got in 2018 and it took a while to get the tenants out to finish their leases and such.
And then eventually once I got their leases completed, I wanted to renovate the units. And so that's happened like end of 2019 and then the pandemic hit. And so I was like, oh crap, like I can't renovate this unit right now because nobody's working.
And so it took a little bit of time, but then I was able to get the refinance, pull the money back out and pay back my S block.
[Stephen Husted] (39:39 - 40:15)
Yeah, okay. How was, what did you learn about that deal? And as far as, I think a good topic would be timelines.
And it's something that I talk about a lot about timelines, that time is money and investing and rehabbing and all that. And I talk about it all the time and it still bites me in the ass. Oh yeah.
I'm going through it right now on a property in Kansas City. We had a timeline of two and a half months. We're six months in still, you know.
[Ashley Cao] (40:15 - 40:17)
That's happened to me many times.
[Stephen Husted] (40:17 - 41:22)
You know, and it's like, and I remember my contract, like I could have done two and a half months. I'm like, God, this is a big project. It's, you know, it's two kitchens, it's three and a half bathrooms, you know, like, you know, it's full renovation.
Like, I don't know how he's going to do this, but you know, he's saying, I'm like, okay, but you know, here we are. Thank God he wasn't, he's a budget friendly contractor. And, but he's probably going to cost me, you know, nine grand on top of that, just for carrying costs, you know, just holding it right now.
But, you know, it is what it is. I tried, you know, I think every deal I try to get better. It's one of those things, there's some things that just get out of your control.
Even if you have a great team, have you gone through where you've had it like an amazing contractor and you're like, oh, this is great. I don't have to micromanage you anymore. And all of a sudden the wheels come off and they're gone and something crazy goes on.
And you're like, oh man, that's it. Now I'm sideways on this rehab. Have you gone through that?
[Ashley Cao] (41:23 - 42:21)
I've gone through, so the first contract that I had for this duplex, I mean, it's my first time, right? And so I was like, okay, I think I vetted them properly, right? This is a little bigger than what this forum told me to do.
And so I think the challenge is, and that's what people fear, is like managing something from a distance. And so the contractor would say like, okay, these are the different milestones that we're gonna hit. You know, this was completed this week.
And I'm like, oh, can you send me pictures? All that stuff. So I thought I was doing everything correctly.
And then somebody suggested to me like, oh, you should have like a person outside of the contractor to go and do like a double check, right? Walk through the property and all that stuff. And I was like, okay, I'm gonna do that.
So I have a friend who I'd met through like BiggerPockets. They look at it, I'll run out there and do it for you. And of course I compensated them for their time.
And so they went out and they're like, nothing's done. And I was like, well, they said. They said.
[Stephen Husted] (42:23 - 42:23)
They said.
[Ashley Cao] (42:23 - 42:24)
I was like, they said.
[Stephen Husted] (42:24 - 42:27)
The photos are from what house? It's like some.
[Ashley Cao] (42:27 - 44:50)
It's the same. It's like Photoshop. It's like Google Photos.
Like, okay, I'm gonna pull a photo of a finished thing. That's crazy. I don't have no.
So I was like, oh my God, nothing's done. And so it was a lot of just like this, like, hey, I had somebody walk the property yesterday. They reported that this wasn't done and all that stuff.
And so it was a lot of back and forth with them. And then eventually halfway through, I was like, you know what? I'm gonna just kind of cut my losses now.
And then I ended up just ending the relationship with that contractor. And then I pieced out everything. And so I was like, okay, I, cause it was a cosmetic rehab.
So they did like countertops, they did flooring, they did paint and all that stuff. And so my approach for the next time was, I'm gonna just try to find one contractor to do one thing and then see how they do there. And then if they can, if it does, if it goes well, then I'll expand the scope for them, right?
And so that was kind of like my way to like, not feel like I have to have them do everything and trial them out before I get the larger commitment. And so that actually worked out really well because I had, that's when I found like my dream contractor and he was like amazing and super responsive and all that. And so he came in and I think he did like my flooring first and was very like professional and everything about it.
And then eventually he ended up doing my whole entire unit. So, so I- How'd you find him? It was through Thumbtack actually.
So I just did a search through Thumbtack and I talked to a lot of contractors though, through these, you know, Craigslist or whatever, Facebook, all that stuff. And I would say like 50% or maybe even more than that, like were not responsive. And so that was a challenge, but so again, time, right?
So I was like holding costs and all that stuff. Yes, adds up. It adds up, but I knew that, you know, I needed to work out the system now and use this property as a way to build out that system because if I just kind of like jumped into another contractor and expect them to do the whole project and then shoot myself in the foot again, then no point.
So, yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (44:50 - 46:37)
It's a big thing. Contractors can just... Like, I feel like a broken record when I talk about contractors, but I try to make it very clear that they can make or break you.
Yeah, yeah. You know, like we learned the hard way and we've scaled so quick during COVID. And, you know, I think we, I think contractors were just spread too thin.
A lot of the good ones, even the good ones were, you know, having problems. They would take on too many projects and, you know, I had one contractor working on three houses and had a very similar story about, you know, taking photos of things, but they were literally taking material, like, oh, here, it's done. And then pulling it out and like taking it over to the other property to like kind of show that that one was done.
It was absolutely insane. And then finally we got smart at getting people on the ground to, you know, walk the property and give us, you know, feedback. Even with like hard money, before you get the draw, they'll send an inspector out, right?
And you would think that they're gonna be one that's gonna be eyes on the ground that understands, but we got burned with just that too. Like they would go, oh yeah, they did the painting. They put the windows in.
No, the windows never got done. This wasn't done correctly. Like we even got burned by the lender's, you know, inspector.
So we've had to even put more layers in there over time. Like now I just hire somebody who's either a handyman, somebody that knows what to go look for. And I make them just dissect the whole house top to bottom, because that's only probably the only drawback of investing in real estate is sometimes you just would love to just go by.
See it in person, because even photos, photos are tricky too. Like photos, they can get you.
[Ashley Cao] (46:37 - 46:41)
You never know. And with AI these days, you never know.
[Stephen Husted] (46:41 - 47:01)
Oh my gosh, yeah. I remember one guy took photos of the kitchen and I'm like, oh, the kitchen's done. The cabinets are in, it's painted, you know.
You can see the counter's in. And then the guy goes by, he goes, I don't know if you know this, but your countertop is in four different pieces that they kind of put together.
[Ashley Cao] (47:01 - 47:03)
I'm like, what if I- Scrap pieces.
[Stephen Husted] (47:05 - 47:37)
Like, oh, we broke it. Just, yeah, just put it together. Add some grout, we'll be fine.
It's so insane. So tell me a little bit about what you're doing now in your new company. And then like where, I know that a lot of things have gone on since that first deal.
Where are you at right now? What do you like working? What's inspiring you?
What's motivating you? And then what are you doing as far as your, you're working in lending now. So you switched all together.
[Ashley Cao] (47:37 - 47:38)
So you got out of tech.
[Stephen Husted] (47:38 - 47:53)
Yeah, yeah. So what made you pivot? Like what, were you comfortable where you were like on cashflow?
Or like, tell me that pivot moment where you're like, okay, I'm getting out of tech, I'm going into commercial lending.
[Ashley Cao] (47:53 - 49:37)
That's it. So I was at Waymo and then I got laid off. And so I was like, holy crap.
Like, so, okay, I guess before that. So I, while I was at Tesla and I was at Waymo, I knew that I wanted to make a pivot outside of tech because I just didn't want to do the nine to five anymore. And so I wanted to kind of build my own businesses and just kind of have a little bit more control of my own schedule.
And so I was like, okay, well, I have a portfolio of properties. I have long-term rentals, mid-term rentals, short-term rentals that I was building throughout the years. And so, and then I had reserves, right?
So I saved up money because I knew that once I made a pivot, it's probably gonna take me some time to get ramped up and make that change. So that was like preparation ever since, because same thing, when I got into real estate investing, that's when I knew, like I read Rich Dad Poor Dad and I was like, okay, I need to like, while I'm earning the salary, I need to build another nest egg or a few other nest eggs in the meantime, in the background. And so I was planning to leave, but I didn't plan to leave that soon.
And so it was the beginning of last year, 2023, it was January of 2023, I got the notice that my role has been eliminated. And so I was like, and I got like a severance package and stuff. So I was like, oh shit, I just got paid to leave.
This is amazing. And so it was like kind of like a blessing in disguise where I knew I wanted to leave already and now I got paid to leave.
[Stephen Husted] (49:38 - 49:44)
And- Pushing you in a new direction. Here you go, we're gonna give you the severance and let you go carve your new path.
[Ashley Cao] (49:44 - 52:34)
Yes. So at first I was like in shock. I was like, oh my gosh, I never got laid off before.
But then I quickly started to realize, okay, this is what I've been working towards, building this portfolio of properties and reserves and all that stuff. And so I was like, hey, I'm just gonna like dive into real estate full-time, stabilize my portfolio, work on my portfolio, and then continue to go to conferences and network. And so during that time, I was involved in a multifamily or apartment syndication.
So I was, we closed on like 110 or 111 units in Dallas in December of 2022. And so I was already kind of on the pathway of like trying to scale my experience in real estate by moving into multifamily and apartments and things like that. And so, and then I got laid off in January and then I was like, and then I went to a multifamily conference in February.
And so at that conference, I bumped into one of my mentors who is the owner of the company I work for right now. And he heard that tech was laying off. So he's like, I heard tech's laying off.
Like, are you good? And I was like, no, I just got laid off last month. So I'm just trying to figure out what I'm gonna do.
And so he's been my mentor for the past couple of years. And so he's like, we should talk more. And so he was the one that was pretty much convinced me to get into lending because it was very similar to what I was doing in the tech world.
So I was talking to engineers or clients, right? And trying to figure out like, what do they need? And then I go find that solution for them, right?
Whether it be a job or whatever it is. And so for what I do on the lending side, the same thing. I talk to clients, like, okay, I'm trying to buy this commercial property and I'm trying to get this type of financing where I want this type of leverage or whatever it is.
What can you do for me? And so I go source that for them. And so I was like, oh, this is super transferable skills.
And then it's just, I have to learn some of the technical things, but it's the same thing on the tech side where I had to learn the language of engineers. And so now learning the language of financing and banking and all that stuff, which I had some experience with on the investor side. And so I was like, this feels right.
And so I just, we talked for a couple of months and I wanted to make sure that was the right move for me. And I wanted to learn about the company and all that stuff. And eventually decided to join them.
And so I joined the old capital lending as a company. And so I joined them last year and it's been just an amazing experience so far.
[Stephen Husted] (52:35 - 52:49)
That's great. Yeah. That's great.
And it's cool. It's a pivot. There's a moment of fear.
You're getting out of your comfort zone of being in tech and the roles that you had and you're going in a new path. It's a lot of fear, but it's also really exciting too.
[Ashley Cao] (52:50 - 52:50)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (52:50 - 53:03)
And you mentioned something that's really a big point. It felt right, you said. And that says a lot.
Kind of like, okay, this is gonna be interesting to learn and it's gonna be scary, but I'm up for the challenge.
[Ashley Cao] (53:03 - 53:04)
Yep. Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (53:04 - 53:06)
Yeah. That's cool. Where are they based out of?
[Ashley Cao] (53:07 - 53:09)
Dallas. So starting in Dallas.
[Stephen Husted] (53:09 - 53:09)
They're in Dallas. Okay.
[Ashley Cao] (53:10 - 53:23)
But we are nationwide and I sit out here in the Bay Area. So I'm kind of remote, but a lot of my clients are actually out here in the Bay Area because they don't wanna buy here. They wanna buy in Dallas or other markets.
That works out.
[Stephen Husted] (53:24 - 53:27)
Do you guys service most markets or what states are you in?
[Ashley Cao] (53:28 - 53:49)
I would say majority of markets. So we have a pretty wide network of investors and lenders. So right now I have projects that I'm helping clients with in Oklahoma, Texas, Washington, New Mexico.
So all over.
[Stephen Husted] (53:50 - 53:53)
Washington, what do you got going on there? What are they doing?
[Ashley Cao] (53:53 - 54:12)
The Triple Net shopping mall thing. And so that one's kind of interesting because it's a little bit older and it looks like the property itself needs a lot of work. So we'll see what's gonna happen with that one, so.
[Stephen Husted] (54:12 - 54:22)
Where do you, you said you're from the Bay Area. Where do you live? I'm in Santa Clara.
You're in Santa Clara? Yeah. Okay, so I'm right down the street from you.
That's crazy.
[Ashley Cao] (54:22 - 54:26)
I know the Rose Garden or the area very well. So they have some good food over there.
[Stephen Husted] (54:27 - 54:35)
Oh yeah. What else you been up to besides work and DJing? Do you have anything else you've been doing?
[Ashley Cao] (54:36 - 54:42)
So work and DJing and then it's winter right now, I think. Right? So is it still winter?
[Stephen Husted] (54:43 - 55:03)
Is it winter? Is it just me or are we having these like different kinds of events? Weather thingy.
Weather events. Yeah. Well, it was like sunny yesterday.
It was like sunny and then like pouring rain. You know, like it's like never had before. Just like pouring on me.
I'm like, I just don't have this.
[Ashley Cao] (55:03 - 55:04)
It's so crazy.
[Stephen Husted] (55:05 - 55:17)
But I- You know, we're Californians, right? You know, you know how we are. We're sensitive to weather.
It's rained, it's rained two days in a row. You know, I need, I need to go to therapy for this.
[Ashley Cao] (55:17 - 55:19)
Oh my God, it's 50 degrees. It's cold outside, you know?
[Stephen Husted] (55:22 - 56:08)
I was making, I was talking to a couple of my friends out in Kansas City. It was before, it was when the Niners were playing the Packers, right? And it was raining at the game.
And I didn't watch the game, but I saw like a rerun of it. But I thought it was an old game because they're playing and there was nobody in the stands. I'm like, wait, was this like a preseason game or like, what game is this?
Come find out it was the game that they're, you know, like, I think it was a playoff game. I'm all, yep, that's Californians right there. The Niner fans are like, it's raining.
Yeah, we're not going. But then you go to like Kansas City or the Buffalo, they'll sit out there and the fridge is cold. Like suck it up and stuff.
They're like, well, we don't do that here in California. We're sensitive.
[Ashley Cao] (56:09 - 56:10)
Well, yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (56:10 - 56:12)
So what else have you been doing?
[Ashley Cao] (56:12 - 56:40)
I think you mentioned snowboarding. So I'm a huge, I'm a big, big snowboarder, not a big snowboarder, but I love snowboarding. And so every chance I get to go up to Tahoe or any mountain that has snow, I try to go.
So that's been taking up a lot of my weekends and stuff, which I have no complaints about. So I'm actually going to Tahoe this weekend and then in a couple of weeks, I'll be in Denver and hitting, or in Colorado and going out to Vail and Beaver Creek, so.
[Stephen Husted] (56:41 - 56:46)
Awesome. Yeah, that's great. Well, where can the audience find you?
[Ashley Cao] (56:47 - 56:57)
I'm on Instagram, Facebook, and LinkedIn. Instagram, it's underscore Ashflow. So it's like cashflow without the C, and so.
[Stephen Husted] (56:57 - 57:00)
Yeah, I like it. It's a clever name.
[Ashley Cao] (57:00 - 57:06)
Yeah. I like it. Yeah, and then you can find my LinkedIn and my Facebook on my Instagram too, so.
[Stephen Husted] (57:07 - 57:41)
Cool, we'll put it in the show notes too. Awesome. Yeah, it's been great chatting with you.
I'm glad we got to catch up. I know, I think I must have DM'd you on Instagram to get you on, I think I saw some, you know what I think I saw? I think I saw one of your stories or maybe one of your posts about DJing.
Okay, yeah. And I'm like, oh, let's get Ashley on the podcast. It just dogged my memory.
I was like, yeah, let's talk to her because I don't think I had, the last time that, when we met, I didn't have a podcast going. Yeah. I think we're only like 16 episodes in at this point.
[Ashley Cao] (57:42 - 57:52)
Oh, awesome. I've listened to a couple of your episodes and I think they're good. I mean, I love the casual kind of, you know, no agenda, let's just talk and flow.
[Stephen Husted] (57:52 - 58:19)
Yeah, I think it's kind of a, let's let it go the way it's gonna go. But it's funny how many people really wanna have some type of like structure of like, okay, what are you gonna be asking me? Like, no, we're gonna let it go the way it goes.
And I think that usually what makes it a little bit more intriguing. So I appreciate you jumping on. And yeah, I have to, at some point, where can I find the whole, your meetups?
Where do you post about those?
[Ashley Cao] (58:19 - 58:35)
So it's on my Instagram too. So if you go, I usually post it there. We also have our website, Invest Capital.
We also have nvstcapital.com. So all of our events and stuff are posted there. So that's the company I have with three other business partners.
[Stephen Husted] (58:36 - 58:41)
What, I know one thing I didn't ask is, what type of music are you DJing? Are you into hip hop?
[Ashley Cao] (58:41 - 59:08)
What are you doing? Mostly hip hop. Mostly hip hop.
So I would say open format. So I kind of throw in different things here and there. And you talked about earlier, just kind of digging for music and that's something I love to do.
So if I'm bored or something like that, I'm digging for new music. And so I think like a depth to the genres where it's like, I don't care what genre it is. I just, if it sounds cool, I'll play it kind of thing.
So, yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (59:08 - 59:18)
That is the absolute great approach to doing it because it's your ear picking it up. It's your job after that to convey it onto the dance floor and let people go like, what?
[Ashley Cao] (59:19 - 59:19)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (59:19 - 59:28)
It's always like that random stuff too that people would never catch. You're just like, you put it out there to like, is that really what you're playing? Yeah.
Yeah.
[Ashley Cao] (59:28 - 59:29)
Yeah, for sure.
[Stephen Husted] (59:30 - 59:47)
Well, thanks again. I really appreciate it. I'm glad we were able to get this on and I'm glad I didn't try to reschedule you because I was fear of gonna be coughing and being sick on this.
But so I'm glad that we were able to connect and yeah, we'll chat down the road.
[Ashley Cao] (59:47 - 59:47)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (59:47 - 59:48)
I appreciate you jumping on.
[Ashley Cao] (59:48 - 59:50)
Are you headed to any conferences this year?
[Stephen Husted] (59:51 - 1:00:11)
Yeah, I'm gonna head, we're heading to, we're gonna do Jesse Vasquez's STR. Yeah. Yeah, the midterm conference.
We're gonna do that. I think we're gonna do another one and trying to put together some type of mastermind at our cabin out in the Smokies.
[Ashley Cao] (1:00:12 - 1:00:12)
Nice.
[Stephen Husted] (1:00:12 - 1:00:13)
For like a yearly thing.
[Ashley Cao] (1:00:13 - 1:00:14)
Okay.
[Stephen Husted] (1:00:14 - 1:00:26)
Maybe on the slow season, kind of get some people together, just go out there and hang out, maybe 14, 15 people and, but so far only just Jesse's is on the calendar. What about you?
[Ashley Cao] (1:00:27 - 1:01:00)
I am going to, so Old Capitol has a conference every year towards the end of the year and that's for multifamily. So I'll obviously be there. And then I'm going to, it's called SARACON.
So it's a community called Subtle Asian Real Estate. It's a community of Asians, I guess, primarily Asians. And so they have a conference every year.
So I'll be there and then I'll probably be at best ever conference in April. And that's also in a multifamily space, so.
[Stephen Husted] (1:01:01 - 1:01:14)
Yeah. Conferences are fun. Hey, look, I mean, I think conferences, it's great.
You'd go there and you can go learn some cool stuff. But I think really the magic is just meeting people randomly.
[Ashley Cao] (1:01:14 - 1:01:15)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (1:01:15 - 1:01:19)
Walking down the street or just going to lunch. Yeah, that's the best part.
[Ashley Cao] (1:01:19 - 1:01:20)
I don't know. That's the best part.
[Stephen Husted] (1:01:20 - 1:01:26)
It is the best part. Yeah. All right, well, that's good.
That's exactly how we're going to lead this because that's how I met you.
[Ashley Cao] (1:01:26 - 1:01:26)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (1:01:27 - 1:01:30)
And I think that's the best part of this whole scenario, especially going to those conferences.
[Ashley Cao] (1:01:30 - 1:01:31)
Yeah.
[Stephen Husted] (1:01:31 - 1:01:33)
But you have a great day.
[Ashley Cao] (1:01:33 - 1:01:34)
Thank you, Steven.
[Stephen Husted] (1:01:34 - 1:01:37)
Keep rocking the turntables. We'll talk again, all right?
[Ashley Cao] (1:01:37 - 1:01:37)
Okay, take care.
∎ Podcast Outro:
[Stephen Husted] (1:01:38 - 1:02:07)
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